Jeremy Baines sent me a screen shot of the way he would have changed TechCrunch. I’m impressed. There is a lot here that I intend to steal. Thanks Jeremy!
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When it comes to the crunch — cre8d design blog
May 15th, 2006 at 6:35 pm -
Jack of All Blogs » Blog Archive » How not to deal with your design firm (TechCrunch Edition)
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May 16th, 2006 at 1:37 am -
CrunchNotes » I’m an Asshole, and other news.
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einfach persoenlich Weblog
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A View from Home
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Pearsonified
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5ThirtyOne | How not to treat your designer
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resiny.org » Blog Archive » Utterly lacking in class
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resiny.org » Blog Archive » Utterly lacking in class
May 16th, 2006 at 9:31 am
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Glad you like it, there are even more ideas bellow the page fold (which you don’t have ), but you will have to commission me for that
Great work! I have to say that the new techcrunch is a bit jarring, but hopefully Mike will be able to implement some of (if not all!) of these improvements.
Looks great!
Far more simple thus better.
I am allready fan of this future new version
Hey, I wrote out a list of similar changes in the comments to a previous post! Recap…
1. more left margin
2. a horizontal AdSense group within the text block, after the topmost post
3. give the right-col nav blocks the whole right column
4. a 2nd adsense group below the right-col nav blocks
5. img button for the email subscribe form
6. move the subscribe link & form to top of right column
If that was helpful at all, I’d be delighted for a little link love for my blog
In any case, do try another rev!
So much cleaner!
Though I rather do like the light green box around the ads. It still has something of a “Weblogs, Inc.” feel about it that is off-putting to me.
love it!
I think the old template had too many ads cluttered in one place. I would have one ad in the top margin (like in the current template), have only the sponsors in the body (this way it also adds more value for the sponsors), and one ad in the footer (or somewhere lower and far away from the sponsors).
put the feedburner count below the network section and it gets my approval
so many thoughts about redesigning, yet when the new look was launched michael said that “Everything wrong with it is my fault for overrulling some of her ideas.”
i just dont get how one could go from that kind of statement to posting other peoples designs on the blog… seems a tad spineless, one’d have thought you work with a designer, tell them what you want, they do that and make it look as cool as possible with the guidelines and then you accept it.
the reality is that not everyone likes change, and not everyone is a designer, so to give way because a lot of people are sending in their ideas, or removing you from their rss readers because they think the site change is crap is cowardly…
seems the biggest problem was people wanted more white, less green, i’d have told them to go suck a lime…
the new design looks cool, whats wrong with a bit of colour and actual design? Jeremy’s new design youve posted makes this page look like a template for a wordpress blog… been there, done that, boring.
Mike,
I think its totally unprofessional of you to post something like this on your blog. First off as an owner of a blog design firm. Your an ass. Your totally disrespecting the original designer for not taking responsibility for YOUR design, and advertising problem.
Taking suggestions and posting it on your blog while ignoring the public comments is like pasting a pretty picture over a pile of dog shit and acting like it isn’t there. But even better you toss the smelly pile of shit on the former designer.
I wouldn’t work for you. And I would recommend other designers to not work for you. I’m not speaking as anyone who knows what happened behind the scene. As I know Rach has a great reputation and have recommended her on a few occassions.
This is shit Mike. Just plain shit. If I could unsubscribe my feed again I would.
i agree with David… this “was” pretty rude of you.
I agree with David, what you are doing here is really a very lousy and disrespectful way to treat someone you work with. I’m not a designer, I’m an enterpreneur like you (or at least I assume you are) and no way I would ever do such an action and completely discredit the person I chose to work with in public. We all don’t know what happened behind the scenes, but you should have first sorted things out there for sure.
I really like the new design (the old one was great, didn’t need a change, but the new one is very nice) and this ‘update’ you’ve posted is not an improvement, really. Yes it’s cleaner (a bit) but it’s a lot more boring.
Michael – Unprofessional and rude. I have always admired the fact that you treat new companies/start-ups with respect and positive regard. It seems you forgot to extend the same courtesy to Rachel.
Kia Ora Mike,
You are a total prick – while Rachel has been treating this hole situation with heaps of Professionalism whilist you have gone and basicly ‘dissed’ her work by posting this.
I think alot of your readers will be very dissipointed in the way you have handled this situation.
Due the fact I know Michael personally, I know for a fact that he can not harm other person non the less his designer who he appreciate so much. (TalkCrunch)
The comment above is not clear to me and I have no idea how a person who claims that Mike is unprofessional, bother to write a comment so unprofessional himself with such an unclear, unjustified and most important not checked arguments.
From my point of view, I think mike is acting just right by giving his readers a stage to express themselves. Discussions like these contribute to the readers and to the website owner and while sharing thoughts and ideas we achieve a better reading experience.
As I mentioned before – the design here is just an extra bonus – the real impotence for people is the writing.
David krug,
In a professional view, I think that as a designer, you could found better and more polite to describe your thought on the subject.
I don’t know what is what, but isn’t the problogger guy throwing a lot of gasoline on this fire?
I still prefer Rachels design, she’s one of the very best blog designers in the business.
Rachel is a big loss for Tech Crunch, its not fair how she’s been treated, but Tech Crunches loss will be other net companies gain.
Oh well done Mike, very classy of you
These are the problems with having so many readers who care, on one hand they want to be asked when you make decisions about the blog such as advertising, full-text feeds etc. – but when you try to engage them on other things like design you are all-of-the-sudden a prick.
When Mike said ‘There is a lot here that I intend to steal’ what he said was ‘there are some ideas here that I will get Rachel to incorporate into our design to further refine it’.
The guy who submitted this built ontop of the original design and just altered a few things – isn’t that a compliment?
Mike always offers me suggestions for the posts that I write here, he criticizes and sends me feedback that others have told him – why don’t the same rules that have resulted in all this shit apply to the writers?
You can’t win in this game..
Mike, I’m not sure what’s worse here: you posting this and essentially shitting on Rachel’s work, or the idea that you’d be “stealing” parts of this instead of commissioning and/or licensing their usage. For a guy seemingly in-tune with the tech industry, it’s a gigantic shame that you’re so out of touch with the design industry.
“When Mike said ‘There is a lot here that I intend to steal’ what he said was ‘there are some ideas here that I will get Rachel to incorporate into our design to further refine it’.”
Nik, that’s probably not going to happen considering Rachel just resigned from working on this site. Now that other designers have seen how Michael treats them, nobody will want to work for him. Consider his foot, shot.
Mike, I just want to say that not all the Diesigners
think alike.
Just keep up the good work and this will go by it self. Too many anger over nothing really.
Mike from BusinessLogs,
This is nonsense what you wrote to Nik and it’s childish and unnecessary fight.
Does that mean I can “steal” the current new blog design that was done by Rachel?
Dave
Taking tips from other work, MikeA calls it ‘stealing’, designers call it ‘inspiration’. Same thing just with added sarcasm.
I still don’t see how posting suggestions for the design is any different to the input process the design went through before it went live. Especially when it is for a large blog where the readers like being part of the process on everything.
I see nothing wrong with doing this. So Mike got a new design for his site and someone sent in a suggestion of how they would do the site. Thanks for sharing it, it’s good to see some different themes on it.
Additionally, sometimes designers just dont get it, so you have to look around.
“Designer”- how can we take someone posting anonymously serious?
This is freaking hilarious!
It’s just a suggested design change, people.
If you really feel like getting your panties in a bunch, there are some more pressing issues to be concerned about (genocide, war, AIDS, bird flu, malicious artificial intelligence, etc.)
This entire thread of conversation is utterly illustrative of how many people call themselves ‘web designers’ yet have no concept or experience of the professionalism involved with working for clients.
For all of your information, a designer hands over work and it gets mauled, improved or altered by a client. You as a designer accept the checque for your work and move on. No client in the world is going to preserve entirely what you provide, ever.
If you can’t take seeing your precious work messed with you are in the wrong business.
And I should add, welld oen to Mike – he saw areas where he thought his design could be improved and showed them – he is the client, he can pursue what is in his best (business) interests.
If the original designer doesn’t learn from it then that is their own thought and they won’t progress.
This is getting out of control!
I don’t think Michael is choosing to diss Rachel by publishing a screenshot of another designer’s take on TechCrunch 2.0. User feedback and iterations are key to getting it right… right?
10 observations, in no particular order:
1. Web design never stands still. It IS an iterative process.
2. Designers cannot be precious if the client is paying.
3. The customer is always right. Even when they are ‘wrong’.
4. Clients can be assholes.
5. If you cannot accept 4) then you shouldn’t be in a client-facing industry.
6. 95% of this criticism seems to be coming from the designer community.
7. TechCrunch shouldn’t be held up as a benchmark of Web 2.0 design. It is the content that is important.
8. Web 2.0 isn’t just about rounded corners and gradients.
9. Bad design will be tolerated by most users (exempting the design community). Bad functionality and bad content will not be tolerated.
10. The user is king.
Wow, as a web designer who’s had their fair share of tantrums because I didn’t get *exactly* what I wanted the client to agree to, I say this is crap. I just don’t see what the fuss is about, and I really don’t understand the hateful venom of people like Mr. Krug. This truly is the problem with the web: people who have no real interest in something feel free to share their opinions no matter how trivial and uninformed.
Mike may, or may not, be evil but it sure wouldn’t be because of posting a comp of an alternative design.
I love democracy…and I love design. When the new techcrunch design came out there was one phrase that stuck with me:
“Everything wrong with it is my fault for overrulling some of her ideas.”
That was a good preface. So here are the facts mixed in with my opnions.
I. TechCrunch redesigned ( I do not like it)
II. Tech world revolts (I like that)
III.Arrington puts up screenshot and declares his intentions to commit grand theft html, design world revolts (I like the design, truly dislike his comments, what is the true reason for the all the green, geez!)
IV. I love the fact that the comments have not been shut down, changed or replaced…as yet.
BIG UP Rachel. I would love to see your first comps. Really I do!
seems that all this post proved is that we graphic designers are overly insecure about our relationships with our clients.
Michael hired a web designer. She did a great job, and delivered product. Michael owns it now. Michael gets more feedback and suggestions and uses it.
That’s called ‘good business’ and a good designer understands that…not publically resigns.
As a DEVELOPER, I have never, ever had a pure-designer who ever understood what work it takes to get their vision into a working format/ application/ something-other-then-just-looking-pretty.
(Designer who had expereince with coding on the other hand… it’s a different story, at least with them you can discuss and come up with solution)
By that end, the design changes.
So Mike wanted more space for his ads, fine, what the big deal?
And he did not ‘Diss’ her design, he just said he also liked this other design. What? He can’t like anything else but the ideas from his HIRED designer?
Damn you peeps, get over your egos. Some people don’t like same things as you and I. Deal with it.
Blah blah blah blah blah blahhhhhh… i’m an expert blah blah… Mike is this.. .blah blah blah Mike is that…
I’d like to submit my own redesign of this wonderful website. It includes adding a big display:none to the comments area.
Well, as a total outsider, it seems like there’s probably a lot more going on than meets the eye, and there’s something a little lacking in class about posting a redesign for something in such a manner.
But hey, that’s what happens when you’re a designer, right? Your work gets mauled, people love it or hate it – if this designer has such the level of status that I seem to pick up, and she’s resigning over this as the last straw – then it’s down to other designers to be wary of picking up the commission. Maybe Jeremy can get the job now!
I don’t think there is much to say about this argument and so I won’t other than I like Andrew’s sentiments.
However, its my opinion (going psychotherapist on you) that the designers are really upset, just not at TechCrunch. Its just latent anger that is being vented from years of build up with other clients and Mike is highly visible.
Mike, I am sure you are trying not to take these comments personal, as you are just too busy turning out great stuff to focus on this but I hope you realise this isn’t about you. This is about everytime a designer does get stepped on, or made to look foolish, or fired, or laughed at.
Its a hard thing taking those moments on the chin and I think unfortunately you are getting the emotional reserve from those moments.
Good luck with your work. I hope one day I reach the 50,000 mark.
Cheers,
Roger
“This is about everytime a designer does get stepped on, or made to look foolish, or fired, or laughed at.”
The designer deos look foolish and it was her own doing. If this is how ‘professional’ designers behave (and if they are all this sensitive), I certainly don’t want to ever hire one.
This is indeed one of the most amusing tossups I’ve seen on the web. Wow is there vitriol out there…
Jeremy’s design is good. Rachel’s design was not (somehow she and Mike didn’t get it together). No big deal. Everyone has a bad game now and again.
Bring in another player. No big deal.
And frankly Rachel’s designs are okay but not world shattering. Can’t quite understand the maudlin loyalty games here – a crew gathering around her to lash out, hard, at the world
I can see both sides of the story. What Mike did was unprofessional. What Jeremy did was self serving and ambitious. If he gives the design for free, shame on him. The simple act of doing design work for free tarnishes all those who make it their profession.
Finally, Rachel was probably right in her decision to resign, since she obviously was offended at what took place. I probably would have been offended too. However, posting your resignation on the blog makes you look petty. She would have been better served by doing it quietly. I’m sure pride played a large role in her wanting to get recognition on Mike’s blog that he did a stupid thing. But doing so lowered her to the level of the person she was quitting over.
i don’t get the tears over this thing. michael has the option as site owner to look at and comment on other designs for his site, even by doing so on his blog. sorry rachel, but if you’re going to be so sensitive about your work, you’re in the wrong field.
these discussions are balderdash.
good design never accures from a democratic (averaged) process.
furthermore the background of the panel members
is unknown or actually questionable.
nice thoughts: http://www.seomoz.org/blogdetail.php?ID=1230
Mike may be a bit of a rude ass, but he’s the frigging client. Personally, I find the comment about Rachel being ‘precious’ to be hitting the nail on the head. She’s got this huge rep from doing a FEW lame blogs that are content huge, but design bad. Now she’s in ‘the club’, and it’s all hype.